EPISODE RELEASED 15th APRIL 2025
HOW MUCH CAN A CHANGE IN DIET INFLUENCE SYMPTOMS OF MENTAL DISORDERS? WHY ARE A DIVERSITY OF PLANTS AND WHOLE FOODS SO IMPORTANT TO INCLUDE, AND ULTRA PROCESSED FOODS SO IMPORTANT TO REMOVE? WHY ARE INFLAMMATION AND MICROBIOME DIVERSITY IN THE GUT SO KEY TO THIS QUESTION? WHAT DOES THIS RESEARCH MEAN FOR THE LIFE-STYLE MEDICINE MOVEMENT AND TO WORLD FOOD POLICY?
In this episode we have the exploding new field of nutritional psychiatry to get to grips with, that is the way our diet can influence and even treat mental health conditions. We’re going to be discussing the historical separation of mind and body by science, which has led to scepticism that diet could influence mental health outcomes; the new understanding of the importance of diversity in our microbiome and inflammation to our mood and mental state; our main topic which is going to be the radical results of recent trials showing large changes in cognitive and mental health outcomes when diet is altered; we’ll get into the foods that can bring about that change and why they work; and we’re going to be getting into the reasons for the broken industrialised food environment that has contributed to the current mental health epidemic in the west; and lastly the massive savings on health that governments can make if they educate people and regulate the food industry properly.
Fortunately, to understand this complex new field, our guest today is the very scientist that risked her reputation to conduct the first trials, facing considerable pushback, only to shift the consensus remarkably quickly with some top science, Felice Jacka. She is the Deakin University Distinguished Professor of Nutritional Psychiatry in Melbourne, the founder and director of the Food & Mood Centre, and of the International Society of Nutritional Psychiatry; She has been cited in over 100 institutional directives for food policy including the World Health Organization and UNICEF; and she is also the author of two books on this for the general public, the children’s book “There’s a Zoo in my Poo” and for adults “Brain Changer: How diet can save your mental health” which we’ll be covering today. Her impact has been so high on public health that in 2021 she was awarded the Order of Australia for her services to nutritional psychiatry.
What we discuss:
00:00 Intro
08:50 The historic separation between mental and physical health.
10:35 People with mental health die about 20 years earlier.
13:30 The connection between the immune system and mental health.
13:50 The hippocampus can grow new neurones even in adulthood which is stimulated by diet.
16:20 New microbiome & chronic inflammation research’s influence on psychiatry.
20:00 Epigenetics, mitochondria (energy generation) & neurotransmitter influences.
21:15 Gut brain axis & oxidative stress response influence.
25:00 Initial pushback from the old guard of psychiatrists.
29:20 Lack of knowledge amongst MD’s and mental health professionals.
32:30 Psychiatric institutions in 2024 named life style medicine as their new focus.
33:30 The SMILES trial results and their integration into the consensus.
38:30 Using the Press to shorten the usual 20 year gap between results and policy change.
41:45 Observing the tipping point in shifting the consensus.
43:00 Industrialised food is the leading cause of chronic disease & biodiversity loss.
43:30 The fault of the industrialised food system: vested interests.
45:00 ‘We’re not going to tell people what to eat’: the food lobby’s ‘nanny state’ argument.
49:15 The ‘Food security for a growing population’ industrialised agriculture argument.
50:00 Soil depletion and the soil microbiome.
50:50 The life-style psychiatry movement: Diet, sleep and exercise.
55:55 Lack of mental health practitioners to meet the needs of the population.
01:02:20 Lifestyle factors feed into each other. E.g Better diet leads to better sleep which encourages exercise.
01:05:30 Take out ultra-processed foods - even the nutritionally balanced ones.
01:11:00 Ultra processed foods bypass the brain’s appetite regulation.
01:12:30 Cognitive ability and memory reduced by processed foods.
01:14:45 Nutritional and energetic equivalt foods have totally different outcomes for the microbiome.
01:16:00 Food Matrix & nutritional ‘dark matter’ - anti-oxidants & polyphenols.
01:19:15 Put in a variety of plants - 30 a week, many types of dietary fibres.
01:20:20 The mediterranean diet - why does it work?
01:24:50 Polyphenol science so far.
01:26:20 %70 of our immune system is in our gut.
01:27:00 Emulsifiers and artificial sugars - the mucosal lining of the gut.
01:28:00 Bipolar disorder and gut lining connection.
01:29:20 Pathogens pass from the gut to the brain via the vagus nerve: New evidence.
01:30:15 Fermented foods - the waste products of the bacteria are beneficial.
01:31:30 Individualised diet approach - still missing data.
01:34:30 Ketogenic diet, mitochondria and Bipolar disorder, but it carries risks.
01:38:45 “Space Farts” Felice’s new kids book to follow “There’s a Zoo in my Poo”.
01:40:45 Space travel issues with microbial diversity.
References:
Felice Jacka, “Brain Changer: The Good Mental Health Diet”
Felice Jacka, “There’s a Zoo in my Poo”
Melissa Lane et al, ‘Ultra‐Processed Food Consumption and Mental Health: A Systematic Review and Meta‐Analysis of Observational Studies’ paper
Adrienne O’Niell et al, ‘Relationship Between Diet and Mental Health in Children and Adolescents: A Systematic Review’ Paper
Felice Jacka’ et al, ‘A randomised controlled trial of dietary improvement for adults with major depression (the 'SMILES' trial)’ Paper
Food & Mood Academy, nutritional psychiatry online courses
‘Clinical guidelines for the use of lifestyle-based mental health care in major depressive disorder’
Adrienne O’Niell et al, ‘Clinical and cost-effectiveness of remote-delivered, online lifestyle therapy versus psychotherapy for reducing depression: results from the CALM non-inferiority, randomised trial’
Kevin Hall et al, ‘Ultra-Processed Diets Cause Excess Calorie Intake and Weight Gain’